In August of 1980, Deming was involved in a Roundtable Discussion on Product Quality--Japan vs. the United States .During the roundtable discussion, Deming said the following about his Deming Circle/PDSA and the Japanese PDCA Cycle, "They bear no relation to each other. The Deming circle is a quality control program. It is a plan for management. Four steps: Design it, make it, sell it, then test it in service. Repeat the four steps, over and over, redesign it, make it, etc. Maybe you could say that the Deming circle is for management, and the QC circle is for a group of people that work on faults encountered at the local level."